Kellinator Jones and the Temple of Snark

I said N. Korea is the biggest threat but I was tempted to say America.

I tend to think we're going to come to something with N. Korea because no one is paying attention to them. While we're out fighting madman dubya's war, they will blow up the west coast. or something. the key will be its when we aren't looking...because we don't want anything from them so why be the aggressor? ::eye roll::

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One of the biggest threats is the United States' dependancy on foreign oil. It's ludicrous now that we have the technology to produce both solar power and electric cars. And of course, there are the hybrids. One of the reasons that Osama Bin Laden hates us is because we politically use Arabian countries for their oil. It's stupid, unneccessary and bad for the environment. A lot of problems could be solved through a gradual movement away from the consumption of petrol by Western consumers.

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The fact is, there are many evil people who should really be disposed of running countries through acts of fear. Saddam and the North Korean leader (whatever his name is, I can never remember it) have extended histories of violence and torture with thier own people. I dont' think we should go to war or not go to war on the basis of one man's opinion, or the opinion of merely the most vocal people, be they in Hollywood, New York, or Matthews, Georgia. It is acting in ignorance if we walk away thinking he doesn't fund terroristic activity. and when i realize that, and remember the bodies falling from the building as i watched the first news reports, it becomes harder to justify inaction.
If the economy is truly as awful as to be compared possibly with the Depression, which was given as a possible answer, then none of us will be able to afford cute hybrid Hondas. Or Hondas at all. Or food for that matter. I dont' think George Bush is a fabulous president. But I don't think any of the options we were given would have been.
I no longer care why they dont like us.

PS-Teddy Roosevelt was the first in line to charge up San Juan Hill.
As a young man, it was a dream of his to go to war. Not that it justifies the current actions of this country.

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I wasnt aware that is why Bin Laden hated us. Hmm... Funny, since that is how his Saudi Arabian family made much of thier money...

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Yes, it's one of the reasons why Bin Laden hates the U.S.

Why is it funny? It's actually quite understandable that he would take an interest in our greed when he is separated ( and disowned) by his own family. He doesn't live off of his family's money anymore. His beliefs are radically "spiritual" in nature and no longer have anything to do with generating wealth. His jihad is intended to ( in his twisted mind) exault the Arab peoples and to obliterate our Western influence from countries like Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Afghanistan, etc. We have infiltrated their culture, and as Osama correctly predicted, once we set up a station in Saudi Arabia, we never left. We're all up in their business, and I for one do not agree with that. If we had minded our own fucking business ( our business being primarily concern for our own selfish use of oil for gasoline, not to "help" the Arab-Muslim countries) Osama Bin Laden would never have perceived the U.S. as "the enemy".

I don't side with him at all, mind you. Osama Bin Laden is a psychopath. His own family disowned him. But we are at fault for certain things, yes we most certainly are.

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or the opinion of merely the most vocal people, be they in Hollywood, New York, or Matthews, Georgia

are you so ignorant that you do not realize that the protests are WORLD WIDE, not just from some hippies in a few major U.S. cities?

then none of us will be able to afford cute hybrid Hondas. Or Hondas at all.

Hybrid cars are relatively inexpensive. In fact, most gas guzzlers (like SUV's) are 5 times as expensive. It's about the price of a very economical car or a used car ($9,000) to convert your old gas-engine cars to run on energy sources other than petrol. And when you compare this slight cost to the current OUTRAGEOUS prices of gasoline and the damage that it does to the environment, the economy and world politics, it's quite meager.

I no longer care why they don't like us.

I'm not even going to dignify this statement with a response.

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By the way, his family isn't Saudi. They live in Saudi Arabia, but Bin Laden's family is from Yemen.

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phantom_wolfboy

You should either amend the start to indicate that you're asking for American opinions, or else take out the part about voting. And put in something about how we should rate the economy where we are . . .

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I can't afford a hybrid car or the conversion you have discussed. I know many, many people who can't. They are like me. they drive a car they maybe spent 2000$ on in the first place.

I am at fault for many things. Would it be justified then for me to walk away if someone in my family was killed through some bizarre act of a nutcase? Or would it only be right to go and find that person, and bring him to justice, along with those who had been an accessory to that act.

If i could erase whatever has happened and could make everyone feel all happy shiny glowy about it, I would.

I don't like war. My father almost missed his high school graduation because he was drafted during Vietnam. We went to the wall to read the name of a boy my parents knew that died there.

Yemen, not pakistan ... and yeah, i did know that. But most people do tend to associate him with Saudi Arabia. I am not ignorant of the supposed motives of Bin Laden. but i cannot think that his ultimate goal is spiritual. He may say that. they may tell us that. but the reasons are ultimately lacking in that certain something...
oh wait. then there's that killing all the jews part....

Does that make it rightfor us to go to war? no.

I admittedly have a different point of veiw on this from most people. I do not wave frothily on either side of this arguement. I do not disagree simply because he is bush, and I do not disagree simply because its war. And I do not simply agree for either reason.

I have watched tons of new footage and pundits on either side of this debate.
i am neither a member of the democratic or republican or libertarian party.

He has to generate wealth for his operations. Weapons don't come cheap. You have to BUY them. Food for his friends, bunkers... all that has money behind it. Even the Japanese and American recording equipment he uses.

I admit Bush likely does have his own reasons for going there. But does it have to make EVERY other reason therefore wrong?

i openly admit I have not officially decided on this matter one way or the other. I have invested a lot of time into it. Pointing a finger in my face and saying "oh yes we have" isnt' going to make my decision any easier.

In fact, responses like the ones this poll from Kellinator garnered are exactly what turns me off and causes me to respond the way I did.

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I am not ignorant. I realize that there were worldwide protests. I have a television just like you. With cable... oooh.

This is the point where I realize nothing I can say can possibly do any good whatsoever.

And right now I have more important things on my mind than worrying over a war that may never happen.

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kellinator.livejournal.com

Oops. Yeah, that was an oversight on my part. Will amend.

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No one "causes you to respond" in any such manner. The way that you choose to react and express yourself is your own responsibility. Aside from making you feel things, another person can't "make" or "cause" you to do anything, even if they have a rifle pointed at your head.

Attacking Iraq with mega-force weapons is not the same as defending your family. Sadaam Hussein is an asshole, but I'd like to point out that Osama Bin Laden isn't the dictator of Iraq, and this impending war has little to do with Bin Laden. Furthermore, it saddens me that so many people in the United States are too short-sighted to assess just how much damage this war could cause - not only in the Middle East, but in the United States. War is expensive, and with so many other countries in protest of this war, it will make even civilian life in the U.S. far more dangerous. You think that terrorists are a threat now? Wait until the world really starts viewing Bush as the madman that he is. Then we'll be "the enemy". You don't think so? Then go on being apathetic and naive. That's entirely your decision.

I'd like to point out that I said originally that the transition from petrol cars to other alternatives should be GRADUAL. I don't expect everyone to go out and buy a hybrid car at the moment - but if solar and electric powered cars slowly became the norm instead of the exception the price of the cars would plummet.

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I have a television just like you. With cable... oooh.

Oh. I'm sorry. I didn't realize that you were an immature smart-aleck with an adolescent mindset. I'll cease this discussion now. It obviously isn't doing either of us any good.

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Hmm.. Only certain types of people must resort to name calling when having a political debate. Thanks for reinforcing my prior opinion. I agree. Goodbye forever.

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That's a load of shit.

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Yay! I was missing Middle School - now you brought it all back. Name calling is fun!

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You call yourself cynical - when you have such faith in the power of other countries to cause havoc and the power of the united states to solve the problem of North Korea (shhhhh...don't tell China...they might worry about a small country right next door to them)

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The Arabs used us for profitability from their oil reserves more than we ever used them. The families of wealth in the Arabian penninsula would be two-bit camel salesmen without the United States.

As for alternates - in the 70s we got 14% efficiency which was better than expected but when oil prices went down we didn't go back to research.

As for Osama - have you read his speeches? He's the ARab Falwell. He hates America because it's lewd and goes against Islamist agendae. You can read Salman Rushdie's article on

pro_war_liberal if you want more info.

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If we had minded our own fucking business ( our business being primarily concern for our own selfish use of oil for gasoline, not to "help" the Arab-Muslim countries) Osama Bin Laden would never have perceived the U.S. as "the enemy

Considering that we also helped him fight a guerrila war against the Soviet Union you're entire way of thinking is stupid.

ANd would Hollywood movies not reach Saudi Arabia without the military? I think not. Baywatch is just as harmful to Islamic extremists as U.S. military intervention.

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No one "causes you to respond" in any such manner. The way that you choose to react and express yourself is your own responsibility. Aside from making you feel things, another person can't "make" or "cause" you to do anything, even if they have a rifle pointed at your head.

So you are NOW saying that Osama Bin Laden has a choice and it isn't the U.S. intervention that caused him.

Make up your mind.

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Yes - and a majority of people believe in Jesus Christ - I don't follow the herd either.

But thank you Pat Buchannan for your insights - as silly as they are.

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misnomer on the Iraq thing. The bombing shooting part of the war will last a couple of months. The process of rebuilding a Western democracy in Iraq will take decades.

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when you have such faith in the power of other countries to cause havoc and the power of the united states to solve the problem of North Korea

Huh???? I'm confused - Where did I say the U.S. would solve it??? The heavy handed implication was that we won't.

And as far as small countires causing havoc? Thats not alarmism. My point was that no one pays attention to the shit they are doing...we scrutinize Iraq while N. Korea is testing missles, shadowing U.S. planes and pumping their people full of propaganda convincing them that the U.S. wants to attack. Check out North Korea's national news site...its fascinating as all hell.

Granted, they obviously do not have the economy to support a full scale war. But that didn't stop them in nam....

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quick question -

why are you, a week later, making comments on this post just to argue with people? I mean,its kelli's journal...its kind of mean spirited to go through and do this.

Not to imply that you aren't entitled to your opinon...I just don't see why its neccesary to waste all the energy to go through and disagree with EVERYONE who commented on this thread. (esp when your comment to me made no sense!)

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"them" meaning the people of vietnam. Just so my words aren't twisted again...

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murphy59

We are all entitled to our own opinions.:)

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